Hey Art: Track Day insurance?

[MikeSTI]

Originally Posted by ArthurS

You can sue for anything nowadays. But I don't think its Wal-Marts Liabilty to make sure people drive safe as long as they have there stop signs in the right spots and stuff. But who knows?!?

what i was getting at is exactly what Art said they have signs in the right spots and stuff a track has no signs and every track i've ever seen has you sign a release of liability if anything happens which is problly the auto inserences little loop hole......they have lots of money too

[ArthurS]

Originally Posted by MikeSTI

what i was getting at is exactly what Art said they have signs in the right spots and stuff a track has no signs and every track i've ever seen has you sign a release of liability if anything happens which is problly the auto inserences little loop hole......they have lots of money too

Well, the nice part about insurance, if they don't exclude it then it is included. no matter what. they can't say 'opps we forgot to put that in there'.

There is also insurance that is strictly for racing events. I believe SCCA offers some type of coverage. Basically the difference is the liabilty limits. You can get a racing policy that has over 1 mil for liabilty for pretty cheap. Your typical auto policy has 100,000 per person/300,000 per accident. That may not be enough during a race event when your car rolls into the crowd and hurts 7 people. So some people go that route when racing or go the route of getting a umbrella policy which also puts a million over your head (but again we don't know for sure if racing is aloud under a umbrella policy).

The head manager is giving me the exact definitions and wording tomorrow. Ill know for sure by then.

[MattR]

Just remember, when asking about it, don't use the old "My friends are wondering if they can race under their insurance coverage" line, or we might get black listed or something

[ArthurS]

Originally Posted by MattR

Just remember, when asking about it, don't use the old "My friends are wondering if they can race under their insurance coverage" line, or we might get black listed or something

Lol. Actually I said that a client emailed me asking if he was covered on a upcoming driving school event. I never mentioned names and I asked to know the exact wording and definitions behind any reasoning. First claims rep I asked here in Reno has been in claims for 14 years and didn't know the answer. So I called Las vegas claims office (Bigger) and I got the answer I have as of now. It seemed to good, so I called the manager at SW Claims office to get the final answer. Find out tomorrow I hope.

[ZER026D]

Sweet

[dknv]

any updates? I'd be really surprised :shock: with the bigger insurance companies, if there isn't an exclusion related to high-speed auto events, such as a track day. One loophole may be for events that are labeled as 'driver education'.

[ArthurS]

Also waiting for the manager to call me back. I placed another call in today. Hopefully by this afternoon.

[ArthurS]

So I have found out this morning that the news was to good to be true. I have gotten written word from a manager from the SW division of insurance. He had mentioned that this is the exception for Allstate and should be the same for almost every other insurance company. They changed the rules last year and have since placed a endorsment onto the automobile policy. I will listed exactly how it reads in the new reply.

[ArthurS]

Allstate Automobile Policy Exclusions in relation to racing. This was a Nevada Amendatory Endorsement (meaning most companies followed with the same endorsement to their own automobile policies).

Part 1, Automobile Liabilty Insurance Coverages AA and BB is amended as follows:

C. Under Exclusions - What is not covered, the following is added:

bodily injury or property damage arising out of the participation in any prearranged, organized, or spontaneous:
a.) racing contest;
b.) speed contest; or
c.) use of an auto at a track or course designed or used for racing or high performance driving; or in practice or preparation for any contest or use of this type.

Part 2, Automobile Medical Payments Coverages CC is amended as follows:

B. Under Exclusions - What is not covered, the following is added:

6. any person arising out of the participation in any prearranged, organized, or spontaneous:
a.) racing contest;
b.) speed contest; or
c.) use of an auto at a track or course designed or used for racing or high performance driving; or in practice or preparation for any contest or use of this type.

Part 3, Automobile Death Indemnity Insurance Coverages CM is amended as follows:

5. Under Exclusions - What is not covered, the following is added:

resulting from injury sustained by any person arising out of the participation in any prearranged, organized, or spontaneous:
a.) racing contest;
b.) speed contest; or
c.) use of an auto at a track or course designed or used for racing or high performance driving; or in practice or preparation for any contest or use of this type.

Part 4, Automobile Disabilty Income Protection Coverages CW is amended as follows:

5. Under Exclusions - What is not covered, the following is added:

resulting from injury sustained by any person arising out of the participation in any prearranged, organized, or spontaneous:
a.) racing contest;
b.) speed contest; or
c.) use of an auto at a track or course designed or used for racing or high performance driving; or in practice or preparation for any contest or use of this type.

Part 5, Uninsured Motorist Coverage SS is amended as follows:

Under Exclusions - What is not covered, the following is added:

bodily injury or property damage arising out of the participation in any prearranged, organized, or spontaneous:
a.) racing contest;
b.) speed contest; or
c.) use of an auto at a track or course designed or used for racing or high performance driving; or in practice or preparation for any contest or use of this type.

Part 6, Protection Against Loss To The Auto is amended as follows:

B. Under Exclusions - What is not covered, the following is added:

loss or damage arising out of the participation in any prearranged, organized, or spontaneous:
a.) racing contest;
b.) speed contest; or
c.) use of an auto at a track or course designed or used for racing or high performance driving; or in practice or preparation for any contest or use of this type.

[ArthurS]

Basically, you are not covered for a damn thing if you are doing any of the things mentioned above. speed contest, racing contest, or anything that is done on a track. So driving schools, driver training (unless done by the DMV), or practice events are not covered.

This means no Liabilty, Medical, Uninsured motorist, Death Indemnity, Disabilty Income, or Comprehensive or Collision losses will be covered.

And when it comes to the street-racing thread thats going on, if you read the line that says "....arising out of participation in any prearranged, organized, or SPONTANEOUS:" This meaning that if the insurance company finds out you are filing a claim that was related to speed-contest or street racing, they DO NOT have to pay out on the claim. Even if it is a Bodily Injury claim.

[sperry]

Well that sucks. My rates go up and my coverage goes down.

What kind of options do we have then for track insurance?

[ArthurS]

Originally Posted by sperry

Well that sucks. My rates go up and my coverage goes down.

What kind of options do we have then for track insurance?

As for Bodily Injury and Property damage, SCCA offers coverage when becoming a member. As for your vehicle, I have no idea as of right now. I will look into it more today to see if a brokerage company has anything to offer.

As for the rates going up. As of December 4th, 2003, WRX rates went up slightly amoung many other vehicles. Mine went up 15.00$ per month.

Causes: Age of new drivers driving WRX's, collison claims associated with WRX's, amount of tickets of drivers with WRX's, liabilty losses associated with WRX's. Since they have been out for a few years now, insurance companies have gathered all te data they need to raise the rate.

[sperry]

Originally Posted by ArthurS

As for Bodily Injury and Property damage, SCCA offers coverage when becoming a member. As for your vehicle, I have no idea as of right now. I will look into it more today to see if a brokerage company has anything to offer.

I'm pretty sure the SCCA coverage is only for SCCA events. So, if I get hurt at Buttonwillow, I'm boned... unless my health insurance from IGT coveres it...?

[ArthurS]

Originally Posted by sperry

I'm pretty sure the SCCA coverage is only for SCCA events. So, if I get hurt at Buttonwillow, I'm boned... unless my health insurance from IGT coveres it...?

I would definatly look into that. I have 2 health plans, one is a dedicated Accident policy which I believe should cover me, but still not sure. I have to place some more calls today.

[Dean]

My exclusions did not read quite as striclty, but I need to see if there have been any updates recently. Do you know when this exclusion was put in place?

[ArthurS]

Originally Posted by Dean

My exclusions did not read quite as striclty, but I need to see if there have been any updates recently. Do you know when this exclusion was put in place?

I do not know when these took place exactly. The gentlemen had mentioned last year. That could mean February or even December. I will call hi back and find out. The sheets he had sent me are titles with 'Nevada Amendatory Endorsement - AU1887-4'.

[MikeSTI]

This info guys might also get you thinking about all those ride-a-longs.....if somthing happens and you have a passenger bad things could happen :shock:

[ArthurS]

Originally Posted by MikeSTI

This info guys might also get you thinking about all those ride-a-longs.....if somthing happens and you have a passenger bad things could happen :shock:

Good point unless it is at a SCCA event in which SCCA has bodily injury liabilty for members. This would cover a passengers injuries. As for buttonwillow, Mike is right. Without proper BI coverage, your passenger's injuries would also be in your hands.

[MikeSTI]

Thats it time to print and noterize sig's from anyone who wishes to ride in my car thats it is at there own risk

[ArthurS]

Originally Posted by MikeSTI

Thats it time to print and noterize sig's from anyone who wishes to ride in my car thats it is at there own risk

I am a Notary Public also. So I can help you Mike.

[sperry]

Originally Posted by ArthurS

I am a Notary Public also. So I can help you Mike.

Yeah well, I'm a Notary Private. So I'm pretty much useless.

[ArthurS]

Originally Posted by sperry

Yeah well, I'm a Notary Private. So I'm pretty much useless.

Yep.

[MattR]

Originally Posted by sperry

So I'm pretty much useless.

Hmm. I didn't say it.

[Dean]

Originally Posted by MikeSTI

This info guys might also get you thinking about all those ride-a-longs.....if somthing happens and you have a passenger bad things could happen :shock:

This is why with the Audi club, you have to be a member even to ride so the club insurance kicks in. Oh, and all the waivers both from the track/venue and club(Audi or SCCA) you have to sign basically make it pretty tough to sue much of anyone for anything.

You can get liabilty insurance for your track prepared car for the padock, and entering/leaving the track if you are so inclined and since you likely don't have it ensured otherwise.

[tysonK]

Racing our cars around a track seems to be pretty expensive and risky.


spendin' all da green, livin' on da edge