Camber Issue - Page 3 - Subaru Enthusiasts Car Club of the Sierras

cody · 2006-05-04, 11:20 AM

Damn, so I have to remove the wheel to make adjustments then. I'll try it out before swapping the Eibach's from the front to rear and installing the OEM's I have in the front because then I'd need an immediate alignment. I'm probably still going to get one to check that everything is okay, but I'd like to keep it simple if possible.

cody · 2006-05-04, 11:22 AM

Thanks guys.

Dean · 2006-05-04, 11:37 AM

Mucking with any of these will likely require an aligmnent. At this point, I think you have the bolts, so just put them in.

Scott and I at least have camber guages you could use to adjust it, but may as well do toe etc. if you are messing around with it, so take the bolts down to a shop and get it done right.

cody · 2006-05-04, 11:40 AM

Sid said the alignment would most likely be less than $100 if I installed the bolts and up to $300 or more if he installed them. I was like, Okay...I guess I know which I can afford. But now that I live in Stead, I don't want to ruin my new tires driving from my house to his shop on a Monday morning...

cody · 2006-05-04, 11:45 AM

Also what kinda sucks is that you install the bolts one way to increase camber and another way to decreas it, so if I used the bolts, I'd have to install the rear ones differently.

cody · 2006-05-04, 11:51 AM

Hey Dean, Do you think the camber gauges you mentioned that you and Scott have would help me get a decent enough home alignment that I could drive 10 miles on the freeway without ruining my RT-615's?

sybir · 2006-05-04, 11:54 AM

Dude, you're not going to hash a set of tires in 10 miles if you're not running crazy toe or massive visual camber. Just take it easy, and you'll be fine.

sperry · 2006-05-04, 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sybir

Dude, you're not going to hash a set of tires in 10 miles if you're not running crazy toe or massive visual camber. Just take it easy, and you'll be fine.

Yeah, I put two days of driving at RFR on my eyeball-aligned car and my tires are still worn perfectly evenly.

You'll be okay.

Kevin M · 2006-05-04, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sperry

Yeah, I put two days of driving at RFR on my eyeball-aligned car and my tires are still worn perfectly evenly.

You'll be okay.

I didn't even eyeball align mine on friday, I just attempted to reset the eccentrics to where they were on the stock springs, thus guaranteeing a less than optimal alignment for the event.

Who knows how good the alignment was in the first place too. But, my tires are still looking good and no alignment settings could have brought down my times enough to catch Chris Vallentino anyway.

sperry · 2006-05-04, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BAN SUVS

I didn't even eyeball align mine on friday, I just attempted to reset the eccentrics to where they were on the stock springs, thus guaranteeing a less than optimal alignment for the event.

Who knows how good the alignment was in the first place too. But, my tires are still looking good and no alignment settings could have brought down my times enough to catch Chris Vallentino anyway.

Here's how I did my alignment:

"Hrmm... the car is a bit darty, probably too much toe-out, I'll just put a half turn of toe-in at each tie-rod end."

"Okay, that was probably too much toe-in... I'll just add some negative camber because I'm too lazy to do the toe again."

"Let's check tire temps... wow, they're even across the tire, and the handling feels pretty neutral-to-understeer. Alignment's done!"

MPREZIV · 2006-05-04, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sperry

Here's how I did my alignment:

"Hrmm... the car is a bit darty, probably too much toe-out, I'll just put a half turn of toe-in at each tie-rod end."

"Okay, that was probably too much toe-in... I'll just add some negative camber because I'm too lazy to do the toe again."

"Let's check tire temps... wow, they're even across the tire, and the handling feels pretty neutral-to-understeer. Alignment's done!"

NICE! Afro-Engineering at it's finest!

sperry · 2006-05-04, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPREZIV

NICE! Afro-Engineering at it's finest!

"Afro-Engineering"? Is that what you need to build this hair-do?

MPREZIV · 2006-05-04, 01:26 PM

I GUESS!

It's just a more technical, "PC" term for N**ger Rigging!

cody · 2006-05-04, 01:34 PM

Alrighty then, I'll just install the bolts in the rear so they reduce negative camber and install the OEM's in the front so they add neg. camber and drop it off at Sid's Monday morning and keep my fingers crossed I guess.

Please let me know (PM or whatever) if anybody can reccomend anything (like a better/cheaper alignment shop, etc).

cody · 2006-05-07, 08:57 PM

I had to use my stock uppipe as a breaker bar but I was successful at removing 99% of the rubbing in the rear (by doing exactly what I proposed in the above post). After I cracker-rigged...I mean DIY'd my alignment, I used a parking lot nearby to "autox" for a while and I did hear the inside of the right tire rubbing a couple times when I would hit a bump on a hard turn. So hopefully my alignment tomorrow will remove 100% of the rubbing.

One thing that sucks is that it looks like the stock camber bolts won't net me as much neg. camber as the Eibach's did.

I used a sharpie to mark the front camber:

Before:

cody · 2006-05-07, 08:57 PM

and After:

cody · 2006-05-07, 09:00 PM

The rear was harder to mark.

Before:

cody · 2006-05-07, 09:02 PM

After (rear):

cody · 2006-05-07, 09:24 PM

Someday I'm going to have to upgrade my sway bars...my car has too much body roll.

cody · 2006-05-08, 09:59 PM

Sid is the man. I'm now running -1.7 all around (I wish I could run less neg. cam. in the rear but I'd have to roll my fenders...), a touch of toe out in the front, and zero toe in the rear. The stock camber bolts wouldn't get me any more than -.5 in the front but luckily Sid had an extra set of cam bolts that fit the lower holes.

khail19 · 2006-05-09, 06:33 AM

Any rubbing still?

cody · 2006-05-09, 07:01 AM

Nope.

sperry · 2006-05-09, 09:15 AM

You may want to check the rules before switching to a points class. I'm not sure running two sets of camber bolts up front is legal... there are some odd rules with regards to camber modifiers.

cody · 2006-05-09, 09:16 AM

Thanks for the heads up. That sucks if that is what ends up knocking me out of ESP.

cody · 2006-05-09, 11:55 AM

15.8 Suspension (Street Prepared) Pg. 86

Quote:

G. Camber bolts may be installed, providing these parts use the
original, unmodified mounting points. Caster changes resulting
from the use of camber bolts are permitted.

I can't tell with that wording if they're SP legal or not. My guess is they are since people use them in the rear all the time when they drop the ride height.

Anybody know?

2006-05-04, 11:20 AM	#51
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	Damn, so I have to remove the wheel to make adjustments then. I'll try it out before swapping the Eibach's from the front to rear and installing the OEM's I have in the front because then I'd need an immediate alignment. I'm probably still going to get one to check that everything is okay, but I'd like to keep it simple if possible. __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo.

2006-05-04, 11:22 AM	#52
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	Thanks guys. __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo.

2006-05-04, 11:37 AM	#53
Dean Señor Cheap Bastarde Real Name: Dean Join Date: May 2003 Location: $99 Tire Store Posts: 9,294 Car: $.04 STI Class: Fast,Cheap & Reliable=STI Deal, did somebody say Deal? Oh, Dean, yeah that's me.	Mucking with any of these will likely require an aligmnent. At this point, I think you have the bolts, so just put them in. Scott and I at least have camber guages you could use to adjust it, but may as well do toe etc. if you are messing around with it, so take the bolts down to a shop and get it done right. __________________ I am a Commodore PET --- Now get off my lawn you kids...

2006-05-04, 11:40 AM	#54
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	Sid said the alignment would most likely be less than $100 if I installed the bolts and up to $300 or more if he installed them. I was like, Okay...I guess I know which I can afford. But now that I live in Stead, I don't want to ruin my new tires driving from my house to his shop on a Monday morning... __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo. Last edited by cody; 2006-05-04 at 11:43 AM.

2006-05-04, 11:45 AM	#55
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	Also what kinda sucks is that you install the bolts one way to increase camber and another way to decreas it, so if I used the bolts, I'd have to install the rear ones differently. __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo.

2006-05-04, 11:51 AM	#56
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	Hey Dean, Do you think the camber gauges you mentioned that you and Scott have would help me get a decent enough home alignment that I could drive 10 miles on the freeway without ruining my RT-615's? __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo.

2006-05-04, 11:54 AM	#57
sybir The Don Real Name: Aaron Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Sacramento Posts: 3,097 Car: '97 Legacy / '05 FXT Class: low	Dude, you're not going to hash a set of tires in 10 miles if you're not running crazy toe or massive visual camber. Just take it easy, and you'll be fine. __________________ Tact is for people who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic.

2006-05-04, 01:26 PM	#63
MPREZIV Token Real Name: Le Stig Afrique? Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: sitting next to a big yellow box Posts: 3,589 Car: 2001 Impreza 2.5 RS Class: 05 TDSP No, I won't work on your car. F your car*	I GUESS! It's just a more technical, "PC" term for N*ger Rigging! __________________ "...these condoms have a topical anesthetic to reduce sensitivity, so you can last longer. What a paradox. You can't feel a thing, but you can fck for HOURS..."

2006-05-04, 01:34 PM	#64
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	Alrighty then, I'll just install the bolts in the rear so they reduce negative camber and install the OEM's in the front so they add neg. camber and drop it off at Sid's Monday morning and keep my fingers crossed I guess. Please let me know (PM or whatever) if anybody can reccomend anything (like a better/cheaper alignment shop, etc). __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo.

2006-05-07, 08:57 PM	#65
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	I had to use my stock uppipe as a breaker bar but I was successful at removing 99% of the rubbing in the rear (by doing exactly what I proposed in the above post). After I cracker-rigged...I mean DIY'd my alignment, I used a parking lot nearby to "autox" for a while and I did hear the inside of the right tire rubbing a couple times when I would hit a bump on a hard turn. So hopefully my alignment tomorrow will remove 100% of the rubbing. One thing that sucks is that it looks like the stock camber bolts won't net me as much neg. camber as the Eibach's did. I used a sharpie to mark the front camber: Before: Attached Thumbnails __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo. Last edited by cody; 2006-05-07 at 09:23 PM.

2006-05-07, 08:57 PM	#66
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	and After: Attached Thumbnails __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo.

2006-05-07, 09:00 PM	#67
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	The rear was harder to mark. Before: Attached Thumbnails __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo.

2006-05-07, 09:02 PM	#68
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	After (rear): Attached Thumbnails __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo.

2006-05-07, 09:24 PM	#69
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	Someday I'm going to have to upgrade my sway bars...my car has too much body roll. __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo.

2006-05-08, 09:59 PM	#70
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	Sid is the man. I'm now running -1.7 all around (I wish I could run less neg. cam. in the rear but I'd have to roll my fenders...), a touch of toe out in the front, and zero toe in the rear. The stock camber bolts wouldn't get me any more than -.5 in the front but luckily Sid had an extra set of cam bolts that fit the lower holes. __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo.

2006-05-09, 06:33 AM	#71
khail19 EJ205 Real Name: Khail Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Reno, NV Posts: 1,769 Car: 2016 VW GTI Meets? We have meets?	Any rubbing still?

2006-05-09, 07:01 AM	#72
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	Nope. __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo.

2006-05-09, 09:15 AM	#73
sperry The Doink Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 20,335 Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata Class: PDX/TT-6 The way out is through	You may want to check the rules before switching to a points class. I'm not sure running two sets of camber bolts up front is legal... there are some odd rules with regards to camber modifiers. __________________ Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints?

2006-05-09, 09:16 AM	#74
cody Candy Mountain Real Name: Cody Join Date: May 2005 Location: Californication Posts: 7,751 Car: 03 Pussy Wagon, now with more pink! Class: TESP OMG Internet!	Thanks for the heads up. That sucks if that is what ends up knocking me out of ESP. __________________ Slow and low, that is the tempo.

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