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Motorsports Chat Autocross, rallycross, and track event planning, as well as general motorsport discussion. |
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#1 |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
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Well, what's everyone thinking about running next season? It's only 5 months away! Time to start planning!
![]() I'm thinking about running SM or NSM. Stepping all the way up to SM means having to throw money at race tires, and having to haul them to each event and change tires before and after racing. Considering the amount of tread I've got left on my Azenis Sports, I could probably get half a season out of 'em yet if I ran NSM instead! For reference here are the '03 PAX values for popular classes (who knows how different next year's will be): NDS: .770 DS: .795 STX: .798 NAS: .801 NSM: .807 AS: .828 SM: .834 According to these, I'm gonna have to pick up a lot of time to be competative in SM... meanwhile NSM isn't that much faster than STX was! Plus since Street Tire is a PAX class, we can all run against each other regardless of car or mods! So, who's in with me for a season of Street Tire!!? Dean and Matt, you guys should run NSM and NAS! ![]()
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#2 |
El Matador
Real Name: Matt Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 10,660
Car: 2012 Toyota Tacoma
Class: ?
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I think I will run street tire next season, I may run NSM too though, because I could do a few subtle mods and potentially really improve. I actually really enjoy running in street tire. NAS might be where I stay though.
We'll see. I don;t know that race tires are in my budget for next season.
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"Dallas..We have a problem.” |
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#3 |
EJ207
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 3,707
Car: 2011 Chevy Battle Wagon
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I think I will still be in STX until I get the new car.
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Captain Murphy: I dub thee Sir Phobos, Knight of Mars, beater of ass. Be a hitter, babe. |
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#4 | |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
|
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__________________
Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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#5 | ||
EJ207
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 3,707
Car: 2011 Chevy Battle Wagon
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__________________
Captain Murphy: I dub thee Sir Phobos, Knight of Mars, beater of ass. Be a hitter, babe. |
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#6 | |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
|
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[quote="ArthurS"]
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Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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#7 | |
Nightwalker
Real Name: Austin Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oshkosh, WI
Posts: 4,063
Car: '13 WRX
YGBSM
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__________________
"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you.. you're locked in here with me." |
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#8 | ||
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
|
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__________________
Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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#9 | |||
Nightwalker
Real Name: Austin Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oshkosh, WI
Posts: 4,063
Car: '13 WRX
YGBSM
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__________________
"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you.. you're locked in here with me." |
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#10 | |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
|
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__________________
Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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#11 | ||
Nightwalker
Real Name: Austin Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oshkosh, WI
Posts: 4,063
Car: '13 WRX
YGBSM
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__________________
"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you.. you're locked in here with me." |
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#12 |
El Matador
Real Name: Matt Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 10,660
Car: 2012 Toyota Tacoma
Class: ?
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I bet S squared could build it!
![]() As far as classes go, i think I will stay in NAS. I think Jim Payne in the other silver STI is going to make a run at SM, I suppose he should run NSM if he doesn't switch to race tires, but either way, i might watch and see how some of his mods work before I do anything. In the short time I've had the STI, I really enjoyed racing the street tire class a lot, I thought nothing could be as great as racing STX with the group, but street tire class is pretty cool.
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"Dallas..We have a problem.” |
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#13 | |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
|
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__________________
Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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#14 |
El Matador
Real Name: Matt Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 10,660
Car: 2012 Toyota Tacoma
Class: ?
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Hmmm? I don't know what exactly I would have to do to take it to SM. ?? Swaybars? ECU? Full TurboBack? Are those legal, that would be fun. But yeah, I think i'm gonna give NAS a run. It will be cheaper...
Also, I can refer to my car as a NAScar..bwahaha!
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"Dallas..We have a problem.” |
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#15 | |
EJ207
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: 39n53, 119w90
Posts: 2,698
Car: RX-8
Class: CS maybe
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![]() You guys may want to find out what John & Patty are going to class in next year -- last year they dominated street tire class. (They'll probably dominate whatever class they go to!) |
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#16 | ||
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
|
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Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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#17 |
Señor Cheap Bastarde
Real Name: Dean Join Date: May 2003
Location: $99 Tire Store
Posts: 9,294
Car: $.04 STI
Class: Fast,Cheap & Reliable=STI
Deal, did somebody say Deal? Oh, Dean, yeah that's me.
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I'd run NSM, but can't find any really sticky 275/40-17 street tires, much less the 315s I'd like to run... No Azinis, or Parada Spec 2s. The KDWs aren't bad but aren't as good as the Falkens.
I also thought about a NCS Miata, but with all the Miata crazies with $3000 shocks at nationals, the CS PAX sucks. Matt and Gary just beat me on Sunday when I drove Sue's Miata, and I was flying about as fast as it could go... Also, be aware that the PAX for street tires will likely become a single additional mutiplier. So in addition to the class pax, there will be a Street tire multiplier of somewhere in the neighborhood of .967 Last weekend getting beat by a BMW and a Mustang proves the Toyos gotta go... I may also have to do something about Boost.. The stock 11 PSI just may not be enough next year... I could run 14-15 PSI on stock injectors, but really need a better fuel pump. And why not Fuel rails, injectors, and an AEM ECU while I'm at it... 11" rims and 315s would really help keeping the 3500+ pounds stuck to the ground, but as we all know, the above all take $$$ I also thought it might be fun to just drive RNP in anybody's car that wanted some instruction, or a tire warmer... I really hope they ban all the fancy schocks in stock class. Sway bars should go as well... |
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#18 | |
El Matador
Real Name: Matt Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 10,660
Car: 2012 Toyota Tacoma
Class: ?
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Also, Dean, what size are your toyo RA-1's?
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"Dallas..We have a problem.” |
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#19 | ||
Nightwalker
Real Name: Austin Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oshkosh, WI
Posts: 4,063
Car: '13 WRX
YGBSM
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__________________
"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you.. you're locked in here with me." |
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#20 |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
|
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They can't ban shocks in stock classes.... they're wear items. How can you tell someone with say a 1965 Porsche they have to run "stock" shocks that are no longer manufactured? They're either running 40 year old shocks, or booted out of stock! You could try to say the shocks have to be "of the same specifications as stock" or something, but that's virtually impossible to enforce... how are you going to prove someone didn't revalve them? SCCA would have to start maintaining a list equivalent shocks, and deal with protests involving opening struts to measure valves! With items like brake rotors and springs, simple inspection is usually enough to verify their "stockness" but with struts, they pretty much have to say anything goes. Same deal with brake pads... it'd be way to difficult to make sure everyone is running "stock" pads.
Honestly, I think the Stock classes and Modified classes are the only somewhat logical classes in SCCA. Of course there's dispute as to which cars go into which sub-class of stock, but the rules are at least pretty easy to understand; basically, in stock you can replace anything that wears out... and the front swaybar ![]()
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Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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#21 |
Señor Cheap Bastarde
Real Name: Dean Join Date: May 2003
Location: $99 Tire Store
Posts: 9,294
Car: $.04 STI
Class: Fast,Cheap & Reliable=STI
Deal, did somebody say Deal? Oh, Dean, yeah that's me.
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They can't ban them, but they can ban external resevoir, and any external adjustment that is not OE.
You can also require that they be sealed non-rebuildable shocks unless the OE were otherwise. That would eliminate all but the most die hard would be cheat. Yes, sombody could carry 10 sets of sealed differently valved schocks, but you couldn't change those between runs like you can a set screw of some form. i think Stock should be as close o the way they rolled off the assemply line as possible, including that it should be a street tire class. Powere to weight would be a great method, but who has a portable 4 wheel Dyno to bring to Tech? 275/40-17s in answer to Matt's question. |
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#22 | |||
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
|
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The one thing that doesn't make sence to me about stock is the front swaybar rule. I guess the reasoning is that so many cars come setup to push for saftey purposes that it kinda makes sense to allow a front bar to dial that out... but doesn't that go against the idea of "stock"... shouldn't you have just purchased a car that doesn't understeer so bad? And why just the front swaybar, why not the rear, or both?
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Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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#23 | |||
Nightwalker
Real Name: Austin Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oshkosh, WI
Posts: 4,063
Car: '13 WRX
YGBSM
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Don't even get me started on how you can weld in an 8 point roll cage (which will run you $1500-2000 at least for a well built, custom cage) to a car in Street Prepared for chassis stiffness, but you can't weld on a couple of subframe connecting bars that cost $80. Idiotic. Anyone from SCCA have that one on their agenda?
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"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you.. you're locked in here with me." |
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#24 | |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
|
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For those of you not on the SCCA mailing list, here they are, in all their glory:
Code:
SS 0.836 ASP 0.848 AP 0.868 AM 1.000 AS 0.828 BSP 0.839 BP 0.863 BM 0.945 BS 0.826 CSP 0.837 CP 0.854 CM 0.913 CS 0.811 DSP 0.819 DP 0.844 DM 0.886 DS 0.794 ESP 0.824 EP 0.861 EM 0.894 ES 0.804 FSP 0.813 FP 0.862 FM 0.889 FS 0.803 GS 0.781 STS 0.791 SM 0.838 FSAE 0.960 HS 0.776 STX 0.795 SM2 0.849 F125 0.938 Quote:
![]() What's really missing from all these numbers is the street tire multiplier. Once we have that, we'll know for sure how fast is "fast" in N*.
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#25 | |
Nightwalker
Real Name: Austin Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oshkosh, WI
Posts: 4,063
Car: '13 WRX
YGBSM
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__________________
"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you.. you're locked in here with me." |
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