May 19 (Sat) PDX & Track Trial @ Reno Fernley Raceway

[A1337STI]

Yeah it was a ton of fun. the course seemed more technical then T-hill . Gave me lots of things to work on

My car ran a bit hot though, was seeing the coolant up to the 2/3's mark although i do have tons of bent fins on the AC heat exchanger up front, possibly something i may need to fix.

[sperry]

Time trials went well, despite the poor scheduling.

*Huge* thanks to Robbie (wrxkidid) for coming out. Without him, there would have been no race. Scheduling pretty much prevented me from working timing and scoring, and Robbie took care of it on his own as a volunteer, with virtually zero help or instruction. Thanks a ton man!

As far as the trials event: We ran a practice session, a qually session, and two races. I ran street tires for practice just to see how things felt, then switched to the Pilot Sport Cups for the qual and race session. I sat out race two since the car was running a bit hot after race one, and stood on my race 1 time.

We race configuration H, which is good for me since it's got less straights than some of the other configurations, and the Vette's eat me up on the straights. I ended up getting Art Majors by a few seconds. I ended up with a 1:52.230 to Art's 1:55.010. Going into the 2nd race, I had the fastest lap time (including laps faster than the two formula cars that were on the grid ). I ended up after race two in third overall (the formula cars finally ran some 1:50's in race 2). My nifty new GPS telemetry gizmo reported a theoretical fast lap of a 1:50.954, which is in the neighborhood of the overall fastest lap of 1:50.361 set by the Formula Atlantic car. So I'm pretty stoked.

I've got some issues with the scheduling of course... us trials guys got very little track time when compared to the other groups, and our runs were all in the afternoon heat -- not that it was all that hot -- but if we do the same schedule this summer, I'm going to end up having to run a total of like 6 laps for the whole day due to heat. Nothing like paying $125 for an autocross number of laps.

Anyway, all in all it was a good event, since I was able to stay ahead of Art's vette. I tell you, if he (and Luke for that matter) ditch the RA-1's for some stickier tires, I'm in trouble. I'm gonna need to get that 100 octane map before the next event!

And just for fun, here's some cool stats from the telemetry from my fast lap:

Max Speed: 128.99 mph (Just one .01 seconds away!! )
Max RPM: 6838 (look Mike, I'm being nice to your motor!)
Max Lateral Gs: 1.89 (most corners show sustained 1.2 G turns )
Max Brake Gs: 1.31

I'm attaching the G-G Plot. I'm pretty sloppy in there. A great driver will minimize the data points in the middle of the diamond. However, I seem to be doing a decent job with my cornering.

Also attached is my lap segment screen cap.

[Joeyy]

Originally Posted by A1337STI

Yeah it was a ton of fun. the course seemed more technical then T-hill . Gave me lots of things to work on

My car ran a bit hot though, was seeing the coolant up to the 2/3's mark although i do have tons of bent fins on the AC heat exchanger up front, possibly something i may need to fix.

Are you running the same 615s you use at autocross? If so, how did they hold up?

[GST Mike]

Originally Posted by sperry

Time trials went well, despite the poor scheduling.

*Huge* thanks to Robbie (wrxkidid) for coming out. Without him, there would have been no race. Scheduling pretty much prevented me from working timing and scoring, and Robbie took care of it on his own as a volunteer, with virtually zero help or instruction. Thanks a ton man!

As far as the trials event: We ran a practice session, a qually session, and two races. I ran street tires for practice just to see how things felt, then switched to the Pilot Sport Cups for the qual and race session. I sat out race two since the car was running a bit hot after race one, and stood on my race 1 time.

We race configuration H, which is good for me since it's got less straights than some of the other configurations, and the Vette's eat me up on the straights. I ended up getting Art Majors by a few seconds. I ended up with a 1:52.230 to Art's 1:55.010. Going into the 2nd race, I had the fastest lap time (including laps faster than the two formula cars that were on the grid ). I ended up after race two in third overall (the formula cars finally ran some 1:50's in race 2). My nifty new GPS telemetry gizmo reported a theoretical fast lap of a 1:50.954, which is in the neighborhood of the overall fastest lap of 1:50.361 set by the Formula Atlantic car. So I'm pretty stoked.

I've got some issues with the scheduling of course... us trials guys got very little track time when compared to the other groups, and our runs were all in the afternoon heat -- not that it was all that hot -- but if we do the same schedule this summer, I'm going to end up having to run a total of like 6 laps for the whole day due to heat. Nothing like paying $125 for an autocross number of laps.

Anyway, all in all it was a good event, since I was able to stay ahead of Art's vette. I tell you, if he (and Luke for that matter) ditch the RA-1's for some stickier tires, I'm in trouble. I'm gonna need to get that 100 octane map before the next event!

And just for fun, here's some cool stats from the telemetry from my fast lap:

Max Speed: 128.99 mph (Just one .01 seconds away!! )
Max RPM: 6838 (look Mike, I'm being nice to your motor!)
Max Lateral Gs: 1.89 (most corners show sustained 1.2 G turns )
Max Brake Gs: 1.31

I'm attaching the G-G Plot. I'm pretty sloppy in there. A great driver will minimize the data points in the middle of the diamond. However, I seem to be doing a decent job with my cornering.

Also attached is my lap segment screen cap.

Glad it went well, also glad you didn't try to find the rev limit on the car as I left it fairly unrestricted (7800rpms)

Any chance I can see the car prior to the next event?

Mike

[wrxkidid]

your welcome scott. i had fun watching and seeing the new car. on that 100 octane map its gonna be ridiculous. are you going to the TEAM event? maybe i could snag a ride if you get the roll bar padded?

it was a lot of fun just being out there seeing the cars and watching the lap times. got me all excited to turn 18 and run out there.

it was also fun cause me and alex started getting my stereo setup figured out.

[sperry]

Originally Posted by GST Mike

Glad it went well, also glad you didn't try to find the rev limit on the car as I left it fairly unrestricted (7800rpms)

Any chance I can see the car prior to the next event?

Mike

When I get into the office on Monday, I'll check my calendar and figure out when I can get it down there. I'd really like to get some more time on the dyno and that 100 octane map.

Here are my notes from the event:

- When the car was cool, it pulled like a freight train. Real nice power, really early torque. None of that goofy hesitation at 4k rpm, no oil issues, great response... at least compared to the previous issues on the last motor.
- During session 1, on the street tires, the car ran cool (oil temp maxed at 245, ETGs to 1600), car felt great. Boost maxed at 1.25 bar.
- During session 2, switched to the race tires, car got a little hot (ambient was over 80 deg F, oil temps to 255, EGTs to 1650), car felt like it was dropping off a little on power towards the end of the session. Boost never above 1.25 bar.
- Session 3, the race, car was great at the start of the session (I ran my fastest lap in traffic), but by the end of the session I was down on power and running hot. With a clean track, I couldn't catch my time earlier in the session. The tell tales on the gauges showed an overboost to 1.5 bar, and 1800F EGTs. I'm not sure when it happened, as I was watching the boost gauge down all the straights... it may have happened climbing the hill or something. I know the boost would nudge over 1.2 bar (where my warning was set) in 4th gear exiting onto the straights but I never saw it ramp up more than the 1.25 that the peaks were at in the 1st two sessions. Oil temps were also a little high, getting to about 260.
- I was having a hard time starting the car as well. Cold starts required leaning on the gas a touch while cranking so when it fired it wouldn't die immediately. Host starts were even worse, where it would catch and turn once or twice, then die in a nice loud back-fire. It seemed like only trying a bunch of times would get it to start... no throttle tricks worked to get it to fire and stay lit.

I'm a little worried about the heat. It was only a little over 80F yesterday and when I really started driving the car, it was getting a little too hot for my taste (the high EGTs are worrisome... but that may be due to the high boost). I was running a little over 4 gallons of 100 octane mixed with fresh 91, so I don't think there was any detonation... at least I never noticed the timing getting pulled, or heard any knocking. I'm thinking of re-routing my wiper sprayer to the intercooler/oil cooler so I can hit it with some water down the straights to get things cooled off.

[dknv]

Scott,
What GPS telemetry gizmo did you get? I just got a MaxQData for autox, (lower end model that primarily measures GPS data points, not lateral load or any of the fancy stuff) and am trying to figure it all out before next weekend.

It was amusing from a spectator standpoint to watch you pull out to the pit lane every other lap in (I think it was) race1, because you kept catching the other cars. (Though probably not amusing from a timed lap standpoint.) I saw Kevin radar you once at 122, and that was when you were starting to brake because you were running into traffic again.

Did you talk to anyone yet about session timing? I would think the PDX groups could be getting their briefing/chalk talk while Time Trials could have a practice session first thing. The problem may be that we were depending on a number of Time Trials participants to also be instructors, so that may have presented too much of a bottleneck.

[wrxkidid]

from entering the schedual into the computer what i decide the best way to schedual it and i think scott agrees is since they combined the 2 pdxs what they should have done is gone with the
1 PDX 2-3
1 PDX 1
1 TT- Practice

2 PDX 2-3
2 PDX 1

3 TT - Qualifying
3 PDX 2-3
3 PDX 1

LUNCH

4 TT- Race 1
4 PDX 2-3
4 PDX 1

5 PDX 2-3
5 PDX 1
5 TT- Race 2

each session at about 20 minutes except for session 2 of pdx 2-3 make that like 30 -35 since they have a bigger on group track so to me that seems fair.
also spacing the TTs out would give more time for adjustments and dailing the car in. I know scott was mad about the Practice lunch qualifying schedual cause he didnt get to eat cause he was changing his tires. Having the TT guys run like that as well would get rid of the 3+ hours of dead time in the morning where nothing could be worked on because they hadnt been out on the track yet.


ill probably time the next one too since im just cool like that.

[sperry]

Originally Posted by dknv

Scott,
What GPS telemetry gizmo did you get? I just got a MaxQData for autox, (lower end model that primarily measures GPS data points, not lateral load or any of the fancy stuff) and am trying to figure it all out before next weekend.

It was amusing from a spectator standpoint to watch you pull out to the pit lane every other lap in (I think it was) race1, because you kept catching the other cars. (Though probably not amusing from a timed lap standpoint.) I saw Kevin radar you once at 122, and that was when you were starting to brake because you were running into traffic again.

Did you talk to anyone yet about session timing? I would think the PDX groups could be getting their briefing/chalk talk while Time Trials could have a practice session first thing. The problem may be that we were depending on a number of Time Trials participants to also be instructors, so that may have presented too much of a bottleneck.

I got a G2X (made by RacePak, but they're owned by MSD Ignition these days). I was torn between the G2X. the DL-1, and one other entry level deal (I can't remember the name off hand...). I went with the G2X because it seems to do just about everything the DL-1 does, but has a display included (the DL-1 display is a $900 option!!). The drawback is that the DL-1 does logging of additional sensors for cheaper, but I really just wanted G-forces, GPS position, and in-car lap times.

So far, it's not bad. The software could be improved (but I think that about everything since I'm in the business). It was pretty easy to install and setup, and it's got lap time, tach, GPS speedo, gear indicator and shift lights all right in front of the steering wheel.

Here's their website: http://www.g2extreme.com/main.htm

[GST Mike]

Originally Posted by sperry

When I get into the office on Monday, I'll check my calendar and figure out when I can get it down there. I'd really like to get some more time on the dyno and that 100 octane map.

Here are my notes from the event:

- When the car was cool, it pulled like a freight train. Real nice power, really early torque. None of that goofy hesitation at 4k rpm, no oil issues, great response... at least compared to the previous issues on the last motor.
- During session 1, on the street tires, the car ran cool (oil temp maxed at 245, ETGs to 1600), car felt great. Boost maxed at 1.25 bar.
- During session 2, switched to the race tires, car got a little hot (ambient was over 80 deg F, oil temps to 255, EGTs to 1650), car felt like it was dropping off a little on power towards the end of the session. Boost never above 1.25 bar.
- Session 3, the race, car was great at the start of the session (I ran my fastest lap in traffic), but by the end of the session I was down on power and running hot. With a clean track, I couldn't catch my time earlier in the session. The tell tales on the gauges showed an overboost to 1.5 bar, and 1800F EGTs. I'm not sure when it happened, as I was watching the boost gauge down all the straights... it may have happened climbing the hill or something. I know the boost would nudge over 1.2 bar (where my warning was set) in 4th gear exiting onto the straights but I never saw it ramp up more than the 1.25 that the peaks were at in the 1st two sessions. Oil temps were also a little high, getting to about 260.
- I was having a hard time starting the car as well. Cold starts required leaning on the gas a touch while cranking so when it fired it wouldn't die immediately. Host starts were even worse, where it would catch and turn once or twice, then die in a nice loud back-fire. It seemed like only trying a bunch of times would get it to start... no throttle tricks worked to get it to fire and stay lit.

I'm a little worried about the heat. It was only a little over 80F yesterday and when I really started driving the car, it was getting a little too hot for my taste (the high EGTs are worrisome... but that may be due to the high boost). I was running a little over 4 gallons of 100 octane mixed with fresh 91, so I don't think there was any detonation... at least I never noticed the timing getting pulled, or heard any knocking. I'm thinking of re-routing my wiper sprayer to the intercooler/oil cooler so I can hit it with some water down the straights to get things cooled off.

Good info Scott!

Nothing that overally concerns me given the fact that I know I have about 3-4 hours more time to invest in the pump tune for you let alone the race gas tune.

The starting issues are an easy fix given a little time and a battery that holds a charge . For now when it's giving you a hard time try holding the loud peddle to the floor when you key on prior to cranking.

Mike

[sperry]

Originally Posted by GST Mike

Good info Scott!

Nothing that overally concerns me given the fact that I know I have about 3-4 hours more time to invest in the pump tune for you let alone the race gas tune.

The starting issues are an easy fix given a little time and a battery that holds a charge . For now when it's giving you a hard time try holding the loud peddle to the floor when you key on prior to cranking.

Mike

I put a brand new yellow top in the car on Friday, and dremeled the bejesus out of the ground connection to ensure good contact to the chassis. It seems to have plenty of cranking power now, but I still hear the voltage changes at idle in the Bosch... I think I need to go to some 1/0 gauge cable for the relocation kit. I tried to get that set up last week, but Summit was out of battery kits with that gauge wiring.

[ivanko]

Scott,

What is the name of the window net company again?

Thanks

Adam

[sperry]

Originally Posted by ivanko

Scott,

What is the name of the window net company again?

Thanks

Adam

M&R:

http://www.mrproducts.com/index.php?...0Window%20Nets

But you don't have to order directly from them, tons of places carry their products.

[A1337STI]

Originally Posted by Joeyy

Are you running the same 615s you use at autocross? If so, how did they hold up?

Yep same set of tires. They held up great! I was worried after the first session because it looked like i had strange wear on my back right, but Dean pointed out it was rubber pick up. By now my tires are basically shaved to 4-5 mm . Really even wear but i have a slight slight touch of toe out all around. I didn't measure too accurately before/after the event. I'm sure i lost some tread but i can't really tell how much, very minimal loss though and for all the driving time we got . most of our sessions felt like they were 30 minutes. 2 hours of track driving easy.

I should check my pads for wear now (they were brand new... were ..)


I've read on grassroots motor sports tire test that the RT615's will over heat a bit but i never noticed any issues. although they probably felt like they had the most grip on about my 3rd lap and slightly less on the 4th. not sure if i was running just a touch too much PSI or what (was shooting for about 38-40 hot, kept coming off the track at 41-42) Scott said to use 38 so maybe next time i just need to run with 3 psi lower cold

[Joeyy]

Originally Posted by A1337STI

Yep same set of tires. They held up great! I was worried after the first session because it looked like i had strange wear on my back right, but Dean pointed out it was rubber pick up. By now my tires are basically shaved to 4-5 mm . Really even wear but i have a slight slight touch of toe out all around. I didn't measure too accurately before/after the event. I'm sure i lost some tread but i can't really tell how much, very minimal loss though and for all the driving time we got . most of our sessions felt like they were 30 minutes. 2 hours of track driving easy.

I should check my pads for wear now (they were brand new... were ..)


I've read on grassroots motor sports tire test that the RT615's will over heat a bit but i never noticed any issues. although they probably felt like they had the most grip on about my 3rd lap and slightly less on the 4th. not sure if i was running just a touch too much PSI or what (was shooting for about 38-40 hot, kept coming off the track at 41-42) Scott said to use 38 so maybe next time i just need to run with 3 psi lower cold

Thanks for the info. I hope to use last years 615's at a couple of track events this year. They have plenty of tread. I may put a yellow pad in for the track events. See ya in June.

[Dean]

A track day typically causes less wear than a day of autocross.

Overheating can be a problem, but you will hear that you are overdriving them before they get there. You should only hear occasional inside tire singing at the track, not constant in corner tire screaming.

They will start to feel greasy if you over drive them, but they will still handle fairly predictably. Slow down and let them cool.

Bottom line, 615s hold up pretty well at the track.

[Kevin M]

I agree with Dean.

I hope you were all sitting down when you read that. (Sorry Cory)

[MPREZIV]

Originally Posted by BAN SUVS

I agree with Dean.

I hope you were all sitting down when you read that. (Sorry Cory)

[Kevin M]

Normally you are standing when you read the internets, right?

[MPREZIV]

Nope! I sit on my service cart!