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Technical Chat Ask and answer technical car questions. |
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#1 |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
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Went out to RFR today... the motor break-in is going well... too bad I can't say the same for the suspension.
I was braking into the horseshoe today when the left-front control arm failed. Left front tire immediately turned 90deg right and slammed into the fender locking it up. I went of in a straight line right up and off the turn. Had to hitch a ride back to Reno from a nice guy named Dimitri with a nice EVO to pick up the truck and trailer (figures the one time I don't trailer to the track, the car breaks). MikeK came back out with me to winch the car up off the track where Danny had dragged it with the ATV. It was a hassle, but we got it back to Reno. So, the damage: it looks like the stamped steel control arm that comes on the WRX (as opposed to the lighter aluminum ones the STi's have) failed... tore straight in half (probably along the weld?). The front swaybar and LF endlink are toast. And worst of all, I'll bet the LF strut is probably busted, which is probably going to be a nightmare to find a replacement for under $1500 since those Tein SuperRace coilover were oh-so-unpopular. ![]() But more importantly, here's what I learned: Earlier in the day in the 1st session out, I noticed the car seemed to pull to the right under hard braking at the end of the front straight. I even mentioned it to Jim Kunze who was out there today. So I pulled off immediately and put the car up on jack stands to inspect everything under there. I couldn't find anything wrong with the inspection, and the steering rack and everything related seemed fine and tight. And before heading back out, I took a few laps around the paddock and really tossed the steering back and forth and things all seemed okay. Then on the second session, I didn't really feel anything weird, but I wasn't braking as hard since I was just trying to settle into a rhythm to putt around putting miles on the car, but that session was cut short when a boost hose popped off at all of about 10psi of boost. ![]() Anyway, MikeK brought his camera out to document my misery... he'll probably post up some picks of the carnage. My question is (most to Cory since I'm sure he's dealt with cars at his show that come in during the winter after hitting curbs), how the hell do you move these things!? Mike and I just dragged the car up onto my trailer w/ the winch, but I'm not sure I know how to get it off, let alone up my driveway and into the garage so I can work on it. I guess I need some sort of wheel dolly... where do I get one? Summit? Harbor Freight? Any suggestions you guys have, I'm all ears.
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Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? Last edited by sperry; 2008-09-01 at 11:32 PM. |
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#2 |
EJ22
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Lake Tahoe
Posts: 175
Car: 05 Legacy GT, 81 RX7
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What a drag... literally! You're right, we need to use all our senses to moniter any changes in a car. Especially when we subject them to more stresses than normal sane people. I'll bet the bearings are fine. Harbor freight has wheel dolleys pretty cheap, I saw them there on Friday.
Glad you're OK |
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#3 |
(40 percent vodka)
Real Name: Joel Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 4,446
Car: 2004WRX
Class: Baby-Hauler/GroceryGetter
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This could work. http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku Harbor freight would obviously be cheaper though.
What are the plans for the car now?
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"A power nap is when you sleep on someone who is weaker than you." - Dimitri Martin |
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#4 |
Señor Cheap Bastarde
Real Name: Dean Join Date: May 2003
Location: $99 Tire Store
Posts: 9,294
Car: $.04 STI
Class: Fast,Cheap & Reliable=STI
Deal, did somebody say Deal? Oh, Dean, yeah that's me.
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I'm glad you are OK and it didn't happen at the end of any of the long straights. That could have been ugly.
Since it is only 1 corner, you might be able to use one or more floor jacks and some helpers to move it around. let us know if you need help. None of the cheap car dollies are designed to handle much other than flat surfaces. Going up a driveway may be challenging depending on the surface transitions. Yes harbor freight has them. A furniture dolly with a cradle or some plywood on it might work as well. You can also take off the wheel and put some fat people in the trunk and right back seat to help. Non-lifting: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=32052 http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=93368 http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=38959 lifting: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=94682
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I am a Commodore PET --- Now get off my lawn you kids... ![]() Last edited by Dean; 2008-09-02 at 06:35 AM. |
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#5 |
(40 percent vodka)
Real Name: Joel Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 4,446
Car: 2004WRX
Class: Baby-Hauler/GroceryGetter
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This way will only cost you like $20 and you don't need to invite your fat friends to eat all your food.
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"A power nap is when you sleep on someone who is weaker than you." - Dimitri Martin |
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#6 |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
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The bigger problem is getting the car down off the trailer. A set of dollies would be pretty easy for moving it around in the garage... and perhaps even up the driveway, though it'd take a bit of muscle... but I don't know that they'll be any use at all getting the car down and off the trailer. We were only able to get it on there by dragging it up with the winch... I don't have a way to drag it off the trailer.
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Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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#7 |
JDM Cowboy
Real Name: Nick Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Somewhere
Posts: 8,642
Car: 2015 Mazda 3
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That freaking blows man
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While a standard engine is powered by a belt connected to the crankshaft, a turbo engine runs on its own exhaust steam, making it more energy efficient. -- CNN |
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#8 |
Señor Cheap Bastarde
Real Name: Dean Join Date: May 2003
Location: $99 Tire Store
Posts: 9,294
Car: $.04 STI
Class: Fast,Cheap & Reliable=STI
Deal, did somebody say Deal? Oh, Dean, yeah that's me.
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Can you strip some to all of that corner while it is on the trailer just leaving a brake caliper with a block of wood strapped into it hanging from the empty strut top hole? Or at least get the wheel off?
If so, then unhook the winch (Which pulls down as well as forward) and use man weight and the e-brake to back it off. I think with you and 2-4 people and a couple floor jacks, we can put it wherever you want. I assume it still runs, so as long as the front left shaft (or lack there of if you pull it) can turn freely, you can start it and "drive" it. very slowly... Cars in much worse shape have been moved with floor jacks. You may have to keep moving them and switching pick up points, but big deal.
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I am a Commodore PET --- Now get off my lawn you kids... ![]() |
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#9 |
Captain Turbo
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Reno
Posts: 3,318
Car: 05 STi
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At least the steering wheel looks straight ...
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#10 |
Señor Cheap Bastarde
Real Name: Dean Join Date: May 2003
Location: $99 Tire Store
Posts: 9,294
Car: $.04 STI
Class: Fast,Cheap & Reliable=STI
Deal, did somebody say Deal? Oh, Dean, yeah that's me.
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That's not bad... pull that wheel and rotor and lets move that pig...
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I am a Commodore PET --- Now get off my lawn you kids... ![]() |
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#11 |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
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Since this isn't really about my engine anymore, I split it into its own thread...
I pulled the wheel off, the damage doesn't look all that terrible. The failure was indeed along the welds on the LCA... when it broke, it allowed the wheel to travel towards the rear and outside of the car and impact the fender. The steering tie rod is what turned the wheel right as the back pulled away. Because the tire jammed up into the wheel well, it appears that with the exception of the swaybar and endlink, none of the suspension components exceeded their normal range of movement. The strut looks straight and healthy, the hub looks okay, even the flimsy tie rod looks unbent. The axle is suspect... it pulled out of the transmission, so I'm not sure if the CVs were damaged or not before things came loose. But back to the matter at hand: getting this pile off my trailer. I pulled the brake rotor and blocked the caliper (so I can still use the brakes on the 3 good corners). Was hoping to just drive the thing right off, but when I attempted to let the jack down, it was obvious that the car is going to lay the frame down on the ground. So, I need a dolly or a wood skid... something to keep the corner off the ground, and able to get down the trailer ramps. It anyone off work now? Feel like coming over and helping drag a car off a trailer?
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Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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#12 |
EJ207
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Reno/Sparks, Nevada
Posts: 3,482
Car: 2000 2.5RS
Class: RestNPeace
Master Slurper.
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Did anyone come over to help? If you can't get it moved today I can help out tomorrow. Today I have to finish my axle/hub/bearing/ball joint/front break job. Unfortunately I only have one means of transportation. Keep us posted.
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"Why do chicks tell you to call and then not answer....so gay." "Cuz girls are fags I dunno" |
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#13 |
Captain Turbo
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Reno
Posts: 3,318
Car: 05 STi
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I there any chance you can just repair it on the trailer?
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#14 |
El Matador
Real Name: Matt Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 10,660
Car: 2012 Toyota Tacoma
Class: ?
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You need a pallet jack.
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"Dallas..We have a problem.” |
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#15 |
El Matador
Real Name: Matt Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 10,660
Car: 2012 Toyota Tacoma
Class: ?
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Or an 8' long 4x4 so it can slide down to the ground.
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"Dallas..We have a problem.” |
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#16 |
Nightwalker
Real Name: Austin Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oshkosh, WI
Posts: 4,063
Car: '13 WRX
YGBSM
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If you can get the LBJ out of the spindle, I'd just do that. Call around to junkyards & get a replacement LCA to throw on there so you can drive it off. If you put a dolly on that corner you don't know what's gonna happen as you're moving it off the trailer, up the driveway, & into the garage.. it could slip off and damage something else.
And, ![]()
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"None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you.. you're locked in here with me." |
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#17 |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
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Welp, Dean took off just now after coming over to help. We used a small 1000 lb rated furniture dolly, my big old Craftsman jack and some planks of wood to roll the bitch off the trailer.
Started with the trailer winch looped around the ass-end of the trailer and hooked to the front of the car to pull it until the rear tires were on the ground, then muscled it the rest of the way by hand from there. It was a PITA, but not terribly so. Big thanks to Dean for the help. Only took us about 90 minutes, and that includes time to park the trailer in the backyard, bullshit a bit, and eat some homemade chocolate chip cookies. Now all I need to do it pull off the potentially busted parts and figure out what needs replacing so I can order up some parts. Anyone know a good place to pick up some '04-'06 USDM STi aluminum LCA's? They're the same as the JDM Spec-C ones that gain you 1.5 deg of static caster. I'll also need a new front swaybar... I'll probably just get another 20-22mm Whiteline one... as that seems to work well with my existing suspension setup. And some new endlinks for sure. Hopefully the axle's alright, and nothing else is bent... especially in the steering rack, since I just finished rebuilding that bitch right before all this happened.
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Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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#18 |
Señor Cheap Bastarde
Real Name: Dean Join Date: May 2003
Location: $99 Tire Store
Posts: 9,294
Car: $.04 STI
Class: Fast,Cheap & Reliable=STI
Deal, did somebody say Deal? Oh, Dean, yeah that's me.
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The front tie down on the Impreza is great for this sort of thing. It is slightly pointy and sticks down below the sub frame so it drops right into the "cup" of old clunky floor jacks. you can even sort of steer it...
We balanced the load between that and a 2x6 spanning the mini dolly under the entire left front sub frame with the sub frame bolt heads cutting into the wood. Worked great. And you are welcome... Yummy cookies...
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I am a Commodore PET --- Now get off my lawn you kids... ![]() |
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#19 |
El Matador
Real Name: Matt Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 10,660
Car: 2012 Toyota Tacoma
Class: ?
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Nice work guys..
Also, I think turn 12 at RFR should be called the "Sperry Corner", given your history there.
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"Dallas..We have a problem.” |
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#20 |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
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Well, I didn't go off there this time... I went off the back of the horseshoe. The exit of old turn 12 is just where Danny and I dragged the car to get it out of the way of the hot track so they could get the sessions back up and running.
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Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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#21 |
El Matador
Real Name: Matt Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 10,660
Car: 2012 Toyota Tacoma
Class: ?
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Oh.
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"Dallas..We have a problem.” |
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#22 |
EJ205
Real Name: It is real! Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: RNO
Posts: 2,367
Car: 1998 Impreza Wagon, 1991 Legacy Turbo Sedan, 2003 Nissan Xterra
Class: tvFree
Yes, I'll fix it for you. Again.
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Man, what a PITA. That's probably not something that happens every day.
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"Trend Number One is that people aren't getting any smarter." Dogbert |
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#23 |
EJ18
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 39
Car: 2002 WRX Sedan
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Oh, tough luck Scott. Hope to see it moving again soon, hopefully without a lot of expensive new parts.
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#24 |
Token
Real Name: Le Stig Afrique? Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: sitting next to a big yellow box
Posts: 3,589
Car: 2001 Impreza 2.5 RS
Class: 05 TDSP
No, I won't work on your car. F* your car
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That blows. That's all I've got...
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"...these condoms have a topical anesthetic to reduce sensitivity, so you can last longer. What a paradox. You can't feel a thing, but you can f*ck for HOURS..." |
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#25 |
The Doink
Real Name: Scott Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 20,335
Car: '09 OBXT, '02 WRX, '96 Miata
Class: PDX/TT-6
The way out is through
|
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I got around to pulling some parts off...
Yanked the busted control arm... it was impossible to pull the ball-joint w/o damaging it, so once the pickle-fork trashed the rubber boot, I just took it off at the knuckle side and left the BJ on the half of a control arm. Looks like I'll need to order a second Whiteline roll-center kit for a new extended ball-joint. ![]() I also noticed that the subframe where the front mounting point for the LCA has cracked welds. ![]() ![]() ![]() I got a closer look at the strut. It's not off the car, but it's unhooked from the knuckle. There's a little less throw that I thought on the upper pillowball, but I still think there was enough to have kept it from getting damaged. But I'm not willing to call the strut "okay" just yet.
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Is you is, or is you ain't, my con-stit-u-ints? |
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