Tein review... aka Does nothing ever go smoothly for sperry?

[sperry]

So, I purchased those Tein Super Racing coilovers a few weeks back. I was originally planning on waiting for my hub conversion to be completed before going to new suspension, but since I my rear Koni's were blown and the car was unsafe to drive on the track, I decided to grab the '04 version of the struts now, and purchase the '05 front uprights when the time came to do the conversion.

I figured, since Tein is such a big name, I'd have no problem ordering new bits for the suspension. I figured wrong. Check this out:

Originally Posted by sperry to TEIN USA

Hello,

I have a 2002 Subaru WRX that I race in SCCA Solo and Time Trials. The car has been converted to a 2004 STI spec drivetrain, including the front and rear hubs. I recently purchased and installed a set of your Tein Super Racing coilovers (p/n DSS28-8USS1). They are *incredible*, much better than both the JIC FLT-A2's and Koni/Ground Control setups I've used in the past.

I am currently converting the hubs on my WRX to 2005 specs (5x100mm to 5x114.3mm) in order to go to larger width wheels as well as gain some reliability with the larger '05+ bearings ('04 STI wheel bearings only last about 5 hours on track w/ race tires before needing to be rebuild/replaced). To complete the conversion, I need to replace the uprights on my '04 front coilovers w/ the '05 spec uprights.

Can you sell the necessary parts to me directly? If not, can you provide me with a part number for the '05 uprights so I can order them through my local reseller?

Thanks in advance for your help,

--Scott Perry
#04 Gruppe-S/StopTech TSM/TT-2 Subaru WRX

Originally Posted by TEIN's response

Dear Scott,

Thank you for your interest in TEIN High Performance suspension products.
Unfortunately, we do not sell directly to the public nor can we sell
individual suspension components to our dealers. We apologize for the
inconvenience we may have caused you.

If you have any further questions, please let us know.

Best regards,
Sales

Staff @ TEIN USA INC.
9798 Firestone Blvd.
Downey, CA 90241
Phone: (562)861-9161
Fax: (562)861-9171
www.tein.com

Originally Posted by sperry's pissed off and replies

To whom it may concern,

What I'm gathering from your email is that I just spent $3800 on suspension that I won't be able to use on my car two weeks from now after I convert my hubs because you can't sell me a particular part of the suspension kit.

What if I were to break something on a strut during competition, does that mean I will be required to replace all four corners at full MSRP because something such as a bolt broke?

I find this to be extremely unacceptable support for those of us that are using your products in a competitive environment. If this is truly the case, and if Tein USA is not interested in providing race-level support for their race-level products, I will have no option but to return my coilovers and purchase from your competitors such as Moton, DMS or Ohlin, who I am sure would have no problem supporting my racing effort.

Please help me to find a solution to my problem that doesn't involve switching brands. I am very satisfied with the quality and performance of your products, but in a competition environment, I *must* have the support of the manufacturer behind the product I'm using. I'm not expecting free parts or service, just the simple option to purchase the bits that I need to keep my car competitive.

If your sales department isn't able to further assist me, please let me know who I can contact to discuss this issue.

Thanks,


--Scott Perry
#04 Gruppe-S/StopTech TSM/TT-2 Subaru WRX

So yeah... anyone racing w/ TEIN bits better not break anything, because it looks like your only option is to completely replace everything as Tein won't sell you any parts.

Hopefully this situation is just some sales guy being lazy and deciding to blow me off. If I could find some more emails for Tein, I'd have just gone over the sales staff head and straight to some customer service rep of some sort, but they don't give squat for contact emails. We'll see what sort of reply I get. I may have to start making phone calls until I find someone that actually cares about getting their product used competatively.

[Nick Koan]

Lame.

They do rebuilds, so I would assume they could do this too. I wonder if its just a company decision to not support these modifications for liability reasons.

[sybir]

Scott, my major hookup on everything JDM just evaporated, but let me see if I can call in some favors if necessary. All you need is the lower, correct?

[Dean]

I wondered how you were going to pull that off. I had assumed you already had the swap dialed in before purchase... Bummer man.

[M3n2c3]

I like your reply, Scott. Very well done.

[MPREZIV]

Dude! WTF!? That doesn't make any sense... Tein says that you can buy kits for rebuilt, or send your equipment in to them for rebuild, so it makes NO sense to me at all that you cannot get replacement parts. That's GOT to be a case of some lazy ass that decided to just blow you off...

[sperry]

Originally Posted by sybir

Scott, my major hookup on everything JDM just evaporated, but let me see if I can call in some favors if necessary. All you need is the lower, correct?

If you can find me some '05 front lowers, that's all I need to do the conversion. I'm willing to guess that the uprights are the same across the entire Tein lineup, so I could probably just swap out the uprights from some friggen '05 Tein BASICs.

In fact, if anyone's planning on buying some Tein coilovers soon for their '02+ WRX or '04 STI, order a set for an '05 STI and I'll trade you my uprights (the only part that's different) and give you $100 for your trouble!

[Dean]

Aren't the Super Racings Monotubes, and the lower end models Dual tubes? If so, I would think the lower section would be significantly different.

[sperry]

Originally Posted by Dean

Aren't the Super Racings Monotubes, and the lower end models Dual tubes? If so, I would think the lower section would be significantly different.

I think the threaded lower sleeve is designed to be universal. So, yes, the strut inside the threading it different but the uprights all have the same threading.

At least, that's my guess after seeing the Flex and Super Race coilovers in person.

[Dean]

As long as they are the same diameter. That is my concern.

[sybir]

I found some front lowers for you from a set of '05 Flex's. Call DBtuned tomorrow

Who loves ya, bitch?

[sperry]

Originally Posted by sybir

I found some front lowers for you from a set of '05 Flex's. Call DBtuned tomorrow

Who loves ya, bitch?

Aaron, you are awesome! Will do.

[sperry]

Tein replied:

Originally Posted by Tein

Dear Scott,

We are sorry to hear that you are upset. We do support motorsport vehicles
worldwide, however we cannot supply individual parts that do not belong on
that original vehicle. We sincerely apologize for the inconvenience.

If you have any further questions, please let us know.

Best regards,
Sales

Staff @ TEIN USA INC.
9798 Firestone Blvd.
Downey, CA 90241
Phone: (562)861-9161
Fax: (562)861-9171
www.tein.com

What the fuck is that about? They'll sell you replacement parts, but not if you tell 'em it's for a different model strut?

Here's my reply:

Originally Posted by sperry to Tein

Thanks for the reply.

Please allow me to rephrase my request.

I have a set of Tein Super Race coilovers for an '05 Subaru STI. I need to replace the threaded lower brackets that attach the coilovers to the knuckles for the two front struts. Please advice me on how to order these replacement parts.

Thanks for your help,

--Scott Perry
#04 Gruppe-S/StopTech TSM/TT-2 Subaru WRX

We'll see what BS that generates.

[sybir]

Bunch of bullshit. Let me know if you want me to try an alternative approach.

[AtomicLabMonkey]

That sounds like a sales manager's (or engineering's) decision to not sell/support any parts for use in anything other than their original designed application. It's strictly to reduce headaches for the staff and cover your ass. I can understand the thinking behind it, we did some of the same thing at MM, but on the other hand we also would usually work with the guys using our stuff and actually racing their cars. If Aaron's hookup doesn't work out, try calling Tein and going up the chain of support monkeys until you get someone who can actually make decisions, they might be more friendly.

[sperry]

Originally Posted by AtomicLabMonkey

That sounds like a sales manager's (or engineering's) decision to not sell/support any parts for use in anything other than their original designed application. It's strictly to reduce headaches for the staff and cover your ass. I can understand the thinking behind it, we did some of the same thing at MM, but on the other hand we also would usually work with the guys using our stuff and actually racing their cars. If Aaron's hookup doesn't work out, try calling Tein and going up the chain of support monkeys until you get someone who can actually make decisions, they might be more friendly.

I'm pretty damn sure the Tein Flex bit *won't* work. I forgot the SuperRace does some weird stuff w/ a non-standard camber bolt, while the Flex's use the stock bolts.

I think I need someone to contact them on my behalf and see if they can't tell Tein they rounded out or otherwise jacked up their lowers and order some new ones. I get the feeling Tein's not going to support me.

As far as understanding their point of view. I get it, you don't want to have people just randomly ordering the wrong bits and breaking more stuff then trying to get it covered. But in my situation, I'm using the suspension for racing, so they won't warranty any busted stuff to begin with, plus the *only* difference between the '04 and '05 struts is the lower bracket, so it's not like I'm really mixing and matching parts, I'm just converting my kit to the '05 spec. If the sales guy would take 5 seconds to lookup the parts list he should see that.

[sybir]

I'll email, Scott. Looking at them what's the most conceivable damage you could come up with for them?

[Dean]

I beleive the most common damage to lower housings is bent/bropken flanges or dented/distorted body due to impact.

Tell them you have done it before, and want spares for each side. Especially on inverted struts, the shafts, and actual damper monotube can remain unscathed. In my coilover research, I saw pictures of some mangled DMSes that were fine except the lower housing was thrashed. They actually design their flanges to fail hopefully before doing damage to the damper.

[sperry]

I think Dean's got the right idea. I guess you can tell 'em you want a spare set for your race car or something. They'll probably just blow you off though.

The other option would be to tell 'em that you had the car aligned at Big-O or something and they attempted to set the camber by rounding out the holes in the lower brackets so the washers could rotate in 'em, but that's a stretch. Maybe just claim you screwed up the install and scratched the hell out of your show car's suspension...

Let me know what you think you can pull off. And, thanks for trying to help me out!

[JonnydaJibba]

That's a lot of bull. They aren't going to have many return or loyal customers with policies like that.

[sybir]

Originally Posted by sperry

I think Dean's got the right idea. I guess you can tell 'em you want a spare set for your race car or something. They'll probably just blow you off though.

The other option would be to tell 'em that you had the car aligned at Big-O or something and they attempted to set the camber by rounding out the holes in the lower brackets so the washers could rotate in 'em, but that's a stretch. Maybe just claim you screwed up the install and scratched the hell out of your show car's suspension...

Let me know what you think you can pull off. And, thanks for trying to help me out!

I bought them used and the lowers are massively corroded and I can't clean them up enough to let the lowers adjust easily. Need a new set as I don't want to try and bring these back and force stuff on a track car.

[sperry]

Originally Posted by sybir

I bought them used and the lowers are massively corroded and I can't clean them up enough to let the lowers adjust easily. Need a new set as I don't want to try and bring these back and force stuff on a track car.

The only problem w/ that, is that the Tein SuperRace coilovers have only been out for like 2 months IIRC. There won't be too many "massively corroded" units out there.

[sperry]

Oh hey, look what reading the manual gets you, the part numbers for the uprights:

'04 Lower Brackets:
Front:
SPS15-H4080-R
SPS15-H4080-L

Rear:
SPS15-H0482-R
SPS15-H0482-L

'05 Lower Brackets:
Front:
SPS15-J3953-R
SPS15-J3953-L

Rear:
SPS15-J3956-R
SPS15-J3956-L

What's stupid is that they gave the '05 rears new p/n's even though they should be identicle parts, since the knuckle they attach too is unchanged on the car.

I wonder if I can just get one of the bigger resellers (Gruppe-S, MPJ, someone) to order me just those parts by number. I don't think C&C will have much luck 'cause C&C is pissed at Tein due to pricing issues.

[sperry]

Okay, I talked to 'em over the phone and finally got someone (the GM apparently) to understand my situation and they will send me some bits, but I gotta FAX 'em a PO by 5pm.

More to come!

[sybir]

Excellent (that's why I posted up what I was thinking, so you could pick out logical flaws, lol)


Now, any news on the wheels?