Gauging interest in 100 octane race gas

[cody]

http://www.need4speedpower.com/torco.html

[MikeK]

Originally Posted by sperry

Or you can pay $7.50/gal at the track here.

Really? I heard rumours of $9 a gal at RFR from someone at SCCA, maybe Art Majors or Jim U, I can't remember.

[sperry]

Originally Posted by MikeK

Really? I heard rumours of $9 a gal at RFR from someone at SCCA, maybe Art Majors or Jim U, I can't remember.

I think I paid $7.50/gal the last time I was there... which was last year. I wouldn't be surprised if it's more now... but $9/gal is out of hand. That's more than *twice* the cost of 91!

[A1337STI]

Quite a while ago i bought a 1 or 2 gallon container of toluene at a home depot, i don't recall the price but it was really cheap. Gas by law in the us is allowed to be ~ 55% toluene, (and higher in other countries) and its like 114 octane. i mixed it up so i'de have 96 and ran it for 2 tanks. It felt smoother, but then a month later i had a Fuel injector problem. (which i think is unrelated since only 1 of the 4 had any problems, And Since the fuel injector treatment subaru wants STI owners to do every 20K miles uses almost entirely toluene as the cleaner)

[random theory - if the added octane let my car boost higher than the fuel injectors would have to inject more fuel then ever before and maybe one of them wasn't up to the task ... I did do a an ecu reset directly after doing that so its possible, or reads well to me ... ]

But the coincidence was enough for me to not want to try that again. I think it was $10 for a gallon, and around $40 for a 5 gallon bucket. Great deal considering its 114 octane, Horrible deal if it does cause damage to things (really really shouldn't thought, considering gas is mostly toluene already)

But gas is formulated to burn well and just mixing in a larger part toluene with out knowing what other catalysts are used and in what amounts, could easily lead to less power.

[Dean]

Originally Posted by A1337STI

And Since the fuel injector treatment subaru wants STI owners to do every 20K miles uses almost entirely toluene as the cleaner)
...
Great deal considering its 114 octane

Hmm... I didn't know we were supposed to do that... Where is that maintenance schedule....

Are you sure Tolulene alone has an octane ratting? And why do flammable in inflammable mean the same thing??? Stupid english language...

[sperry]

Originally Posted by A1337STI

[random theory - if the added octane let my car boost higher than the fuel injectors would have to inject more fuel then ever before and maybe one of them wasn't up to the task ... I did do a an ecu reset directly after doing that so its possible, or reads well to me ... ]

Higher octane gas will not "let your car boost higher" unless you've reprogrammed the ECU to allow higher boost. Using an octane booster will do *nothing* for the car unless it was already pulling timing due to poor gas. And at our altitude, you can nearly run a stock STi on 89, meaning 91 is already *plenty* high.

[MattR]

Anybody know where I can get some @(!& so this thread will make sense.

[Dean]

Originally Posted by MattR

Anybody know where I can get some acid so this thread will make sense.

HCl or H2SO4? Pool supply store for the former, finger down your throat for the later.

[sperry]

Originally Posted by Dean

HCl or H2SO4? Pool supply store for the former, finger down your throat for the later.

This kind:
Lysergic acid diethylamide

[Nick Koan]

Originally Posted by Dean

Hmm... I didn't know we were supposed to do that... Where is that maintenance schedule....

Are you sure Tolulene alone has an octane ratting? And why do flammable in inflammable mean the same thing??? Stupid english language...

Damn the latin language for screwing up our english. The prefix 'in' can mean both 'within' and 'not' so the latin adjective inflammare (with the english suffix -able) describes an object which is combustible (can catch fire) not non-combustible.

Totally random theory, but back before the atomic elements were discovered, the brightest minds thought there were five elements, earth, air, fire, water and Captain Planet. Every object contained one or more of these elements. When something was lit on fire, it was releasing the internal fire. Fire wasn't something that happened to the object, fire was being released from the object and the flames are representations of the fire being released. The ash was an after effect of fire violently releasing itself into the wild. The thinking went something like ...

I have a stick that isn't burning (stick 1).
I have a stick that is burning (stick 2).
I put the stick 2 next to stick 1.
Now stick 1 is burning.
I take away stick 2, but stick 1 continues to burn.
Quod Erat Demonstrandum: both sticks contain the element of fire, because otherwise stick 1 would stop burning when stick 2 was removed.

Therefore, if something had the inner flame, it was liable to catch on fire if it got around other elements who's inner fire was being released.

Strangely enough, flammable wasn't even a word up until last century. The words inflammable and non-inflammable were used to describe objects that were combustible and non-combustible respectively. The French use the word ininflammable to describe non-combustible materials. How weird is that. The UK and the US have since popularly adopted flammable and non-flammable (or combustible and non-combustible) as safety guidelines, but inflammable and non-inflammable are still in usage. Its a language drift, and I bet we'll see inflammable and non-flammable fall out of popular usage altogether in the next 100 years or so.

[sperry]

Just don't say "irregardless", or Nick will wear out the internet looking for its entomology.

[Dean]

Originally Posted by nKoan

Damn the latin language for screwing up our english...

Um, it was an inrhetorical question...

[cody]

Originally Posted by sperry

This kind:
Lysergic acid diethylamide

This is the only LSD I'm currently interested in:

[Nick Koan]

Originally Posted by Dean

Um, it was an inrhetorical question...

I believe the word you are looking for is irrhetorical.

[Nick Koan]

Originally Posted by sperry

Just don't say "irregardless", or Nick will wear out the internet looking for its entomology.

What does the study of insects have to do with anything?

[sperry]

Originally Posted by nKoan

What does the study of insects have to do with anything?

Damn you spell checker!!



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Etymology

[Kevin M]

Originally Posted by nKoan

What does the study of insects have to do with anything?

Fire ants?

[Kevin M]

Oh, and CAPTAAAAAINN PLANNEEEET!

[sperry]

Okay folks, I think I've got a line on 100 octane unleaded... I ended up doing the leg work accidentally:

I was looking for a transfer tank for the bed of my truck, but after going to like 5 places on a wild goose chase, I ended up at Summit to grab another two 5 gallon cans. Mike Sesario (sp?) works there and I got to bullshitting with him about race fuel. He pointed me to Rich Davis Racing who's up in Golden Valley. I called Rich, and asked about buying some 17 gallon cans of gas. Rich's order just went in earlier today, but he's calling back to see if he can't add some 100 unleaded to the order.

Either way, Rich said he never gets requests for unleaded 100, but I told Rich there might be 5 or 6 of us that would be interested in it, which sparked enough interest for him to consider keeping a 55 gallon drum on hand.

I'm still planning on getting two 17 gal drums for my house, that way when one's out, I can start on the second while I go refill the first out of Rich's big drum.

As far as pricing, he asked what Allied Washoe was charging. I told him $6.50/gal and he laughed because he's selling his 110 leaded for $5.95/gal and implied he'd be able to beat the AW price pretty easily.

The drawback of course it the trip to Golden Valley, but if everyone's interested in doing the same deal as me w/ the 17 gal drums, we can simply load up the truck every now and again with the empty cans and head up there to refill them. The drums cost $30, with a $25 return fee if you trade 'em in... or you can simply refill the same drum over and over, and save yourself the $5.

The alternative is buying a 55 gal drum for the garage, and getting a forklift to deliver it (they weight like 350 lbs, no way I'm unloading that off my truck) and are a little to big to be safe at the house IMO.

If anyone else is interested (Mike? Dean? Matt?) let me know, and I'll fill you in on the details. Remember, even if you're not tuned for 100, tossing in a few gallons per tank when you're out at the race track is a good idea for motor safety, especially when it's hot.

As far as this weekend, I think I'm going to be hauling out six 5 gallon cans of 100 from Allied Washoe, just to avoid as much of the track's $8/gal gas as possible. But I'm guessing that won't be quite enough for a full weekend at the track.

[MikeK]

AW gives you 5 gallons free for every 50 gallons you buy, so it works out to about $5.90 long term and it is really convenient. How much exactly will this new deal cost? Will there be specific times when we can/can't go to get the stuff? Do they have an electric pump or do we have to pump the stuff manually? AW has free candies in a bowl at the front desk, what does this guy have?

[tysonK]

Where at in Golden Valley? Since I live close I can stop by.

[sperry]

Originally Posted by MikeK

AW gives you 5 gallons free for every 50 gallons you buy, so it works out to about $5.90 long term and it is really convenient. How much exactly will this new deal cost? Will there be specific times when we can/can't go to get the stuff? Do they have an electric pump or do we have to pump the stuff manually? AW has free candies in a bowl at the front desk, what does this guy have?

Going to AW is more convenient than just refueling in your own garage?

Plus, if you're in my shoes, where you need more than one tank of gas at a time, AW isn't even a real option. They're only open 'till noon on Saturday. When I'm out of fuel at 5pm Sat, I'm SOL for getting more before Sun, unless I've got a can at home. Right now, I've got 10 gallons of 100. That should be enough to nearly top off the tank in the car. Then I'm going to head over to AW tomorrow w/ my six 5 gal jugs to fill them up. That's 15 + (5*6) = 45 gals of fuel. If my mileage on the 100 octane is similar to my mileage on my old 91 map, that's enough for 4.5 20 minute sessions each day, running me short on fuel over a full weekend. Hopefully, my mileage is a bit better than it was in the past, but I still need a solution for getting large amounts of fuel in manageable sized containers, thus the goal of going with the 17 gal drums.

Even better would be a 60 gallon transfer tank in the back of my truck, so I could just head out to Davis Racing and fill up the truck, and refuel the car off the truck whenever... but I haven't been able to find a local place that sells transfer tanks at any price, let alone something I can afford (online they're like $1600 for one with an electric pump, plus $200 shipping ).

[Dean]

Just an FYI, I have two 100 octane 30 gallon drums in my garage, one empty and one never opened but likely only good as paint thinner by now.

I also own a drum pump.

Not sure it this helps or not in the grand scheme. They are about as large as one person can manage and get into a pickup.

Scott, you could use the empty and return your new gas cans for this weekend if you want...

I was considering picking up 5-10 gallons of 100 to top my 91 with giving me an honest 93 or so.

[sperry]

I totally forgot you had drums Dean, I thought they went away when you "moved" to Vegas.

My gas bottles are unreturnable, I already filled 'em up in order to top off the WRX tonight. I'll keep the drums/pump in mind, how safe is a drum like that in the bed of a pickup? What are the dimensions? Is it legal to use a drum like that for transporting fuel, or does it need to be sealed or something during transport?

I think my ultimate goal is to get a truckbed transfer tank which would make drums/pumps useless, but a 30 gallon drum might work for this weekend. You coming to the meet tonight Dean? I'll talk to you about it then?

[Dean]

Yes, I'll be there.

Drums are legal and safe to carry in the bed of a truck. Think of them as big metal gas cans. they have two openings both of which are screwed in. (One is big crescent wrench size, the other is medium pipe wrench.) Much less likely to leak than most gas cans IMHO.

Just strap it to one of the front corner's of your bed is best.